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Old 9th February 2018, 01:56 PM   #1
zeta4
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Default RTAB's

Im going to replace the RTAB's on my car next week as the cars done 100K and
I dont think they have ever been changed.

Just going for oem not poly so ordered some Lemforder ones from ECP.

They came as Lemforder p/n 27191 01 and BMW p/n 33326770786. Realoem quotes the p/n for the
M3 as 33326770817 so Im worried I might have the wrong ones.

So looked in the Lemforder catalogue and it quotes 2 p/n's for the M3
27191 01 and 35038 01. So on the face of it its right but does anyone know
why Lemforder quote two. Is one better than the other ?

Im probably being a bit OCD but Ive had the wrong parts before
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Old 9th February 2018, 01:59 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeta4 View Post
Im going to replace the RTAB's on my car next week as the cars done 100K and
I dont think they have ever been changed.

Just going for oem not poly so ordered some Lemforder ones from ECP.

They came as Lemforder p/n 27191 01 and BMW p/n 33326770786. Realoem quotes the p/n for the
M3 as 33326770817 so Im worried I might have the wrong ones.

So looked in the Lemforder catalogue and it quotes 2 p/n's for the M3
27191 01 and 35038 01. So on the face of it its right but does anyone know
why Lemforder quote two. Is one better than the other ?

Im probably being a bit OCD but Ive had the wrong parts before
I have a brand new set of Meyle mate Iím about to put up and sell?

I can send you pics. Drop me a PM
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Old 9th February 2018, 02:28 PM   #3
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Thanks for the offer but Ive already got the Lemforders !
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Old 9th February 2018, 03:10 PM   #4
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I think there was perhaps a revision on them. Some looked different to others when I was looking but I forget the detail.

Is the M3 part number(s) different from a regular 3 series?

I don't imagine there is anything special about them. Mind and set the support cradle level with the axle when you tighten it back up with the through bolt (before re mounting the cradle in the shell with its 3 bolts). Thus ensuring no preload on the bush. I found a slim 2ft piece of timber served nicely for this. I had a fight getting the old ones in out as well. Butchery was required!
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Old 9th February 2018, 03:18 PM   #5
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It seems that both RTAB's will fit but the p/n given in Realoem 33326770817 is for a later reinforced one for the M3. Mister Auto show both but ECP do not. Neither say why there are two p/n's. To save time Ive ordered the correct ones from my local dealer. Price was quite good.

So if anyone is about to change their RTAB's use the correct p/n.

ps Just seen your post. The M3 RTAB seems to have wider slots in the outer bush so I think when it is compressed it clamps the rubber
bush tighter or something like that. Luckily my friendly indie is doing it for me along with a few other bits.

Last edited by zeta4; 9th February 2018 at 03:22 PM.
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Old 9th February 2018, 03:43 PM   #6
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As said above I’m sure they revised the design and one part number superseded the other one. I think the difference is the outer metal part. One version is solid all the way round and the other one is split in two halves. Not sure which is the latest version though.
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Old 9th February 2018, 05:19 PM   #7
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Ill know tomorrow when I pick up the oem ones from BMW. In realoem it doesnt say that the M3 specified one replaces the one I got from ECP.
They seem to be for two separate applications.

The ones Ive got from ECP have two slits in the outer cylinder. From photo's it seems that the M3 specified ones look different with a wider slot.
As I said Ill be able to compare them tomorrow. If they are significantly different Ill try to post some photo's

I do know that these two replaced an earlier design with a flange. I had these in the E36 M3.

I would be replacing them myself as I did with the E36 but my back says no.

Last edited by zeta4; 9th February 2018 at 05:22 PM.
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Old 9th February 2018, 05:36 PM   #8
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I want to get my bushes done on car, Got a set of RTAB's,

So I was thinking if there anything else worth replacing at the same time,

Is it worth getting a new set of Roll bar bushes or should I just replace the whole bar as it comes with new bushes from H&R or eibach anti roll bar ?

Any bushes that require replacing at front ? Cars just gone over 100k so thought it might be time to refresh a tad ?
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Old 9th February 2018, 05:55 PM   #9
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Im replacing the front control arm (lollipop) bushes as well due to the mileage concern.
The car was originally going in to have an exhaust hanger replaced but I decided to
have the bushes done while I was at it. Ill see what the old ones look like when I get them off.

I tried Turner ARB's (same as H&R) and while they certainly helped with the handling they
did make the ride a bit harsher, which I didnt like even on the softest setting. My nearly worn out
Continental M3's on 19's (and potholes!) could have been contributing though. Anyway I took them off
and will probably try again when I change the tyres.

When I replaced the old ARB's I replaced the bushes. The old bushes looked very tired so well worth replacing.
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Old 10th February 2018, 11:58 AM   #10
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Apart from the price, why not get Rogue RTAB's?
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Old 10th February 2018, 05:49 PM   #11
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Yes I agree they are a better engineering solution but I dont track the car and dont want
any worse NVH. I might fit limiters If I dont get the improvement I expect.

Anyway I got the oem bushes from BMW this morning and yes there are two different
ones p/n 33326770817 is for E36 M3, E46 M3 and Z4 and p/n 33326770786 for the
rest according to BMW. Both will fit the E46 M3 but the correct p/n is a stiffer design
and looks different.

The slits in the outer shell are 5mm wide in the correct M3 one and 2mm in the other.
When the bush is inserted correctly with the slits facing up/down the extra compression
due to the wider slits stiffens the bush in the fore and aft direction. Dont know how
much difference it actually makes in practice but BMW did go to the trouble to specify
them so they must have some effect

So if anyone is about to refresh their RTAB's get the right p/n.

Last edited by zeta4; 10th February 2018 at 05:54 PM.
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Old 11th February 2018, 05:31 PM   #12
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You re right iam checking mine here with my vin
http://bmwfans.info/parts-catalog/E4...pension/#pos_4
and its the 33326770817
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Old 11th February 2018, 06:04 PM   #13
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They revised the design so they’re easier to fit as far as I’m aware. You’ll notice the original items are solid metal all the way round, revised items have small gaps.

I bought Meyle HD ones but ended up fitting powerflex ones, assumed they’d be a lot easier to fit but had to use the bush puller to get the black track ones in anyway!
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Old 11th February 2018, 06:48 PM   #14
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No both of these have been in use for some time. The old ones were solid all the way round with a flange
and had a habit of falling out. Ask me how I know.

The gaps seem to be there to compress the rubber when they are inserted. Where the slots are the rubber
is cut away. I should put up some pics but Im not very good at that. They need a g clamp or something to
compress them before inserting.

How do the Meyle ones look ?
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Old 11th February 2018, 07:04 PM   #15
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What do you guys think of using limiters? Limiters are for bush life?
Oem bush + limiter for a street driven car?
Any other bushing change while being there?
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Old 11th February 2018, 07:23 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeta4 View Post
No both of these have been in use for some time. The old ones were solid all the way round with a flange
and had a habit of falling out. Ask me how I know.

The gaps seem to be there to compress the rubber when they are inserted. Where the slots are the rubber
is cut away. I should put up some pics but Im not very good at that. They need a g clamp or something to
compress them before inserting.

How do the Meyle ones look ?
E36 used to have the flanged RTAB too and all those are now revised to split bush too. It's nothing special or M specific.
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Old 12th February 2018, 07:57 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeta4 View Post
Yes I agree they are a better engineering solution but I dont track the car and dont want
any worse NVH. I might fit limiters If I dont get the improvement I expect.

Just to note, even if you fit powerflex black series (90 shore) polybushes you will not get increased NVH.
I fitted these and mine drove like abrand new car afterwards with full geometry re-calibration and set up.

The OEM RTAB solution is another design flaw (on top of the boot floor) from BMW if you ask me. They are a garbage design that cannot withstand what the application they were intended for.
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Old 12th February 2018, 08:15 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AshE46M3 View Post
Just to note, even if you fit powerflex black series (90 shore) polybushes you will not get increased NVH.
I fitted these and mine drove like abrand new car afterwards with full geometry re-calibration and set up.

The OEM RTAB solution is another design flaw (on top of the boot floor) from BMW if you ask me. They are a garbage design that cannot withstand what the application they were intended for.
Totally agree. Owned my car over 10 years and from 30k miles. Now on 115k. My original RTABs were shot when I got the car, changed for oem and within another 30k they were shot again. Changed to Powerflex and they have been perfect ever since. And there is no increase in noise, vibration or harshness whatsoever. I recently replaced them at 115k as part of a rear end refurbishment that saw every nut, bolt, bush and joint replaced. Only changed them as I wanted everything to be brand new, but they were still in perfect condition.
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Old 13th February 2018, 12:50 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaharias View Post
What do you guys think of using limiters? Limiters are for bush life?
Oem bush + limiter for a street driven car?
Any other bushing change while being there?
OEM RTABs + RTAB limiters for the win.

OEM ride quality/compliance but the limiter massively increases bush life and also stops sideways flex of the bush. This improves feeling/handling.

It's what I run on my own M3.

I sell the Turner RTAB limiters if you decide to go down this route
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Old 13th February 2018, 04:31 PM   #20
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Cars going in on thursday for work including the RTAB's. Im using the M specific ones. It will be interesting to see what improvement I get if any.
Ill report back. Ill probably fit limiters next. Havent decided between Turner and the Rogue ones.
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