The M3cutters - UK BMW M3 Group Forum
 

Go Back   The M3cutters - UK BMW M3 Group Forum > M3 and M4 Talk > E36 M3 (1991-1999) and E30 M3 (1986-1990)



Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10th July 2018, 08:30 PM   #81
E46CoupeM3
Achieved official socks
 
E46CoupeM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: England
Posts: 14,783
Car: 2001 BMW M3
Colour Combo: Carbon Black
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
Trust me, when you are doing this because of a car with ****ty repairs and vosges that have all come back to haunt you, it matters!
In 2017 a 320 would be written off for a bumper scratch. You would need to inspect though

If the 328 is as good as said go for that.
However, if you want it back on an M3 log book eventually take a pass and either store it or tactical fix and wait.
E46CoupeM3 is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 11th July 2018, 09:44 AM   #82
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Yeah I'm leaning towards the 328i. Just need to find out about the DSC removal now.

Is there any issue with the M3 clocks plugging straight in?

Anybody have a decent guide for any of the swap over stuff? Getting the engine and box out (I read something about having to drill out some spot welds on the radiator support?), is it a case of:

Remove intake manifold (something about access to the engine hook)
Disconnect prop from gearbox
Unbolt engine mounts
Unbolt gearbox mounts
Remove the cradle
Disconnect fuel lines
Remove radiator support and radiator
Remove oil cooler
Remove headlights and other front end bits
Remove air con stuff
Ready to pull out? Or is there something I've missed?

I think the fuel line is different on the Evo, the connector on the fuel pump end being the difference. Guessing I need to drop the oil as well as the coolant. Can the engine sit safely on its sump when out of the car?

What issues will I face putting the M3 ECU into a DSC car? Can the DSC fuse just be pulled or do I need to re-pin the ECU plug or anything like that? If I should just keep to a pre facelift car then now's the time to tell me!

Oh and is the engine being out the best time for the ARP bolts and new bearings? If so, I best get on with buying some of the King race bearings. Guessing standard size likely to be fine?
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 09:57 AM   #83
Tris
Achieved official socks
 
Tris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,428
Car: E46 M3 and an e36 M3 Evo track car
Default

You can't use DSC on an s50 so just unplug what you can and leave it redundant.

Best approach is to strip the 328i of anything non M then move onto the M3 and meticulously unbolt one thing/area at a time then move it over onto the new chassis. Don't just go like a bull in a china shop unbolting stuff left right and centre. You will get in a mess unless you know the e36 chassis like the back of your hand.

Yeah do the bearings and bolts. S50 factory bearings are very good so I would just buy factory bearings and ARP bolts.
Tris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 10:52 AM   #84
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tris View Post
You can't use DSC on an s50 so just unplug what you can and leave it redundant.

Best approach is to strip the 328i of anything non M then move onto the M3 and meticulously unbolt one thing/area at a time then move it over onto the new chassis. Don't just go like a bull in a china shop unbolting stuff left right and centre. You will get in a mess unless you know the e36 chassis like the back of your hand.

Yeah do the bearings and bolts. S50 factory bearings are very good so I would just buy factory bearings and ARP bolts.
Already got the bolts but not convinced by factory bearings for track use. Why do big power builds not use them? Just to add another name to the spec or something more? Bit nervous about doing the bolts and bearings though as it will be a first time job for me. I'll just follow the ARP procedure and hope for the best. Sounds like plastiguage etc. is a bit overkill as the bearings will be standard size unless the crank has been reground.

Yeah I'll be taking a lot of pics. Engine will come out of the non M car first as my dry run. I have a spare front subframe which I'll be welding reinforcement plates to and some brand new front wishbones I've had in a box for almost 3 years now
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 11:15 AM   #85
Iain
Achieved official socks
 
Iain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Isle of man
Posts: 3,478
Car: AMG estate
Default

people (like me) dont use oem bearings as alternatives are cheaper.

There is nothing wrong with factory bearings
Iain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 11:17 AM   #86
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iain View Post
people (like me) dont use oem bearings as alternatives are cheaper.

There is nothing wrong with factory bearings
Can't wait to see what mine look like to be honest, on 157k
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 11:48 AM   #87
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Also noticed that RealOEM says the M3 Evo has a different MC and brake servo to the 328i. Have to find out how to get that out too and maybe pull a hard line from the M3 if one of them has a difference size nut on it.
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 11:49 AM   #88
Tris
Achieved official socks
 
Tris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,428
Car: E46 M3 and an e36 M3 Evo track car
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
Already got the bolts but not convinced by factory bearings for track use. Why do big power builds not use them? Just to add another name to the spec or something more?
My old 350bhp s50 ran the original bearings for 5 years on track. I had no issues and sold the engine on with no issues.

S50's don't have a bearing wear issue, they have a rod bolt stretch issue (which I am not even convinced is an issue in the later sintered rod engines)

So, what would you rather stick in your engine? Bearings that have been developed by M and proven to last 150,000 miles with dubious service history across 20 years, or some race bearings that cost twice as much and are most likely based on the same product. Personally, I haven't seen any evidence of these race bearings lasting 150,000 miles. Even with my new supercharged s54 I thought long and hard about it but eventually went for OEM bearings.

After all, people were only seeing wear on s54 bearings after 90,000 miles and my tracked and boosted engine is not likely to last anywhere near that long before I burn a valve or blow a hole in a piston
Tris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 11:50 AM   #89
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tris View Post
My old 350bhp s50 ran the original bearings for 5 years on track. I had no issues and sold the engine on with no issues.

S50's don't have a bearing wear issue, they have a rod bolt stretch issue (which I am not even convinced is an issue in the later sintered rod engines)

So, what would you rather stick in your engine? Bearings that have been developed by M and proven to last 150,000 miles with dubious service history across 20 years, or some race bearings that cost twice as much and are most likely based on the same product. Personally, I haven't seen any evidence of these race bearings lasting 150,000 miles. Even with my new supercharged s54 I thought long and hard about it but eventually went for OEM bearings.

After all, people were only seeing wear on s54 bearings after 90,000 miles and my tracked and boosted engine is not likely to last anywhere near that long before I burn a valve or blow a hole in a piston
Possibly. What part numbers did you use out of interest? Was it one red at the rod side and one blue at the cap side or something along those lines?
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 12:03 PM   #90
Tris
Achieved official socks
 
Tris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,428
Car: E46 M3 and an e36 M3 Evo track car
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
Possibly. What part numbers did you use out of interest? Was it one red at the rod side and one blue at the cap side or something along those lines?
Something a long those lines. I only changed my S54 bearings though so it's irrelevant....
Tris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 12:15 PM   #91
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Ah OK. I notice there's a Lithuanian seller selling ACL bearings but they seem to be the only one and I'm always skeptical about the authenticity from these places...

This job is going to be a right ball ache with a short timeframe to work in. Engines swapped over, Brake servos and MC swapped over, ASC removal... Can anyone advise whether I'd be better just pulling the entire chassis loom from the M3 and transferring that over along with the engine loom?
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 08:48 PM   #92
grdaniel
Achieved official socks
 
grdaniel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Scotland
Posts: 1,161
Car: RS182
Default

Nah cas your saloon loom will have wiring for rear doors and all there gubbins, coupe needs the micro switches etc etc, you gonna cause yourself hassle
grdaniel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 09:11 PM   #93
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by grdaniel View Post
Nah cas your saloon loom will have wiring for rear doors and all there gubbins, coupe needs the micro switches etc etc, you gonna cause yourself hassle

But will I be able to just chuck my clocks in and my engine and ecu and it all connect up? Or will there be some reading of the diagrams required and repinning?

ASC looks easy. The throttle body for it will be removed and the engine loom will be changed to the M3 one. Where the ASC light would be there won't be a light. Not sure if that's it sorted or not.

Last edited by Bluesmoke; 11th July 2018 at 10:06 PM.
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 09:13 PM   #94
E46CoupeM3
Achieved official socks
 
E46CoupeM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: England
Posts: 14,783
Car: 2001 BMW M3
Colour Combo: Carbon Black
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
(I read something about having to drill out some spot welds on the radiator support?),
That's a load of rubbish.
You can, you don't have to.
E46CoupeM3 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11th July 2018, 10:05 PM   #95
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E46CoupeM3 View Post
That's a load of rubbish.
You can, you don't have to.
Don't have to drill out the welds or don't have to remove it?
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2018, 06:57 AM   #96
E46CoupeM3
Achieved official socks
 
E46CoupeM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: England
Posts: 14,783
Car: 2001 BMW M3
Colour Combo: Carbon Black
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
Don't have to drill out the welds or don't have to remove it?
both.
It doesn't come off without removing the welds
You wouldn't drill the welds without a reason
E46CoupeM3 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2018, 09:15 AM   #97
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by E46CoupeM3 View Post
both.
It doesn't come off without removing the welds
You wouldn't drill the welds without a reason
So you are saying I can take the engine and box out without removing the whole front end? Won't that make it a lot harder?

Should I remove the bonnet?
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2018, 11:35 AM   #98
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F223056365588

Shame that's not half the price. I'd have that.
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2018, 12:05 PM   #99
Iain
Achieved official socks
 
Iain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Isle of man
Posts: 3,478
Car: AMG estate
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesmoke View Post
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?m...2F223056365588

Shame that's not half the price. I'd have that.
Why? looks like a load of rusty $h1te to me
Iain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th July 2018, 12:07 PM   #100
Bluesmoke
Achieved official socks
 
Bluesmoke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Leeds, West Yorks
Posts: 804
Car: 1996 M3 Evolution Saloon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iain View Post
Why? looks like a load of rusty $h1te to me
I know I've looked at it properly now and decided it's probably no better than mine
Bluesmoke is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools
Display Modes



All times are GMT. The time now is 05:43 AM.


This website uses cookies. By continuing to use the site you are agreeing to our use of cookies. To find out more about the cookies this website uses, click here.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2007 - 2018 M3cutters. All Rights Reserved.